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Iain Abernethy
Iain Abernethy's picture
Iain and Jesse Enkamp on the crescent kick and retuning-wave kick

For those who have not seen it, in this video Jesse Enkamp and I give our views on the application of the turning crescent kick (me) and the retuning-wave kick (Jesse).

All the best,

Iain

PS The YouTube link is HERE

Wastelander
Wastelander's picture

I saw that last night, and thought it was a fun idea. I'd love to do something similar with Waza Wednesday, even! As for the applications presented in the video, I preferred yours over Jesse's. It's kind of an apples to oranges comparison, since they aren't the same movements, but there were some points about Jesse's that didn't fit with my preferences for application. Of course, you and I don't always agree on things, either, but everything you covered fits for me on this one :)

Les Bubka
Les Bubka's picture

I seen this yesterday too, you got my vote Iain. 

As I do very similar application and don't know Naihanchi. 

Kind regrads

Les

Nimrod Nir
Nimrod Nir's picture

Hi guys,

I think it is appropriate that my first comment in this forum is on a collaboration video of Jesse and Iain, as I originally got to know Iain's work through Jesse's work :)

Wastelander wrote:
I saw that last night, and thought it was a fun idea. I'd love to do something similar with Waza Wednesday, even!

I also liked the idea behind the video, and would love watching an Iain vs. Noah version(s?) on Waza Wednesday. 

Wastelander wrote:
As for the applications presented in the video, I preferred yours over Jesse's.

I also liked Iain's better than Jesse's, but that's not what I wanted to talk about.

In 7:06-7:58 of the video, Jesse talks about a kyusho bunkai variation, before elaborating about his own bunkai.

Of course, I accept the notion that there are weak points in the human body which could be exploited in the context of self-defense. A fine example for that is Iain's recent take on the dropping ippon-ken sequence in Nipaipo (5:25-5:40):  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edmWLBpz73s&t=4s   A wonderful weak point which I personally utilized many times in "self-defense" against overly enthusiastic child karateka gangs :) (Side-note: having gangs of children attack you as a playful game is a good self-defense excercise). 

However, throughout my years of practice, I have never experienced or witnessed a "magical" kyusho technique being successfully pulled off, as described by Jesse in the video. I can't see how the Uke in that situation got to the ground in full spasm mode, unless the teacher hit him really hard on that temple (causing brain damage), or that he landed awkwardly from the leg trip and hit his head on the ground really bad. I also cannot see how the kidney shot has anything to do with it.

I am already familiar with Iain's view on this, and I guess I share his approach regarding the issue of kyusho jutsu and chi/ki (as I understand it from his work and from his comments in this forum). 

My question to you guys: Do any of you have a personal experience confirming some of the "myths" of kyusho jutsu? If so, what's your take on it? I would love to watch a video of a successful demonstration, but considering the inherent reliability problem with such videos, I understand that it would not verify the notion (let's just say that every related video I watched so far, seemed to demonstrate really poor acting skills by the loyal Ukes :)

I'd love to discover something new...

Best, Nimrod

karate10
karate10's picture

Good video and techniques, but honestly, my vote goes to Iain's as his variations strategy of Bunkai's is endless without end. "Theres more than one way to go to Kansas" as we say here in the States and that is the case for Karate bunkais.....Best wishes...Gerald.

Kevin Webb
Kevin Webb's picture

Gotta vote for Iain's.  That spinning version of the crescent kick is one that I think most people use very bad variations for (elbow breaks for instance).  However - Iain, one thing that was missing (if I can be so bold as to critique)...in kata, the spin is often a full 360, the spinning variation you showed was basically 180.  I am a fan of "relative position" as one of the reasons for turning in kata.  In this case, 180 turn but opponent also turns during the technique resulting in the 360.  Curious as to your take on the reasoning behind the 360 degree turn....

Kevin Webb
Kevin Webb's picture

Noah - What about a monthly Waza Week where you pick a sequence from a kata and we get various practitioners to weigh in on applications or principles from that techinque over the course of a week?

DW
DW's picture

I liked both versions. However as many have pointed out Iain's version have more applications and takes into account that an attack is often chaotic and sometimes the first thing you try doesn't work as planned. 

Iain Abernethy
Iain Abernethy's picture

Kevin Webb wrote:
However - Iain, one thing that was missing (if I can be so bold as to critique)...in kata, the spin is often a full 360, the spinning variation you showed was basically 180.

It’s in there, but maybe not highlighted enough. You will find your answer at 3:34 seconds :-) https://youtu.be/aXuZ6vFAdu8?t=3m34s

As I say, the first “180” spin is the takedown. The kata then “resets” (what I call a “linking step”) to say that if the throw was not appropriate then you will still be in front of the enemy (the embusen always giving us the relative angle to the enemy) and the shuto would be your best option. If the kata did not reset to the front, it could be misleading as it would infer you were now behind the enemy.

To give an example from another kata, at the start of Pinan Shodan we have two sequences at 90 degrees from the centre line. The fact they are both 90 degrees from the centre line tells us we are at 90 degrees to the enemy when applying the technique (left or right). However, the first sequence is 180 drees from the second one, but we don’t get confused by that because we know it is the embusen we are measuring from. We don’t say the first sequence is at 90 degress to the enemy and the second sequence 180 degrees to the enemy. It is the same with this one. We are back on the centreline to make clear we are in front of the enemy. So there isn’t a 360 spin in my view, there is a 180 throw, a reset to the front, then the showing of a back up option.

I hope that helps?

All the best,

Iain